Harvard Business School

Victor: It is my pleasure to interview Ryan Patterson, who is the creator of the “How to Get Into Harvard Business School Toolkit”. Today he will be sharing with us some of the key mistakes great applicants make when applying to Harvard Business School. Ryan, thanks for joining us here today.

Ryan: Victor, thank you very much. I’m very excited to share with you not only the commone mistakes people make when applying to Harvard Business School but also some of the key principles my classmates and I followed in getting into the Harvard Business School MBA program.

Victor: Great. Ryan, I was reading through your bio in the “How to Get Into Harvard Business School Toolkit” and I just have to ask you one question before we get started. Is it really true that you were a UPS package handler and had a 2.9 GPA from Idaho State?

Ryan: Believe it or not, Victor, that’s true. You know, when I look back at my profile, there were definitely some things that I had going against me. I didn’t exactly have the most impressive academic record in the world. I was even passed over for a promotion at my job. To be perfectly honest, I wasn’t sure if I had a chance.

Victor: So how in the world do you get in?

Ryan: Well, that’s the interesting part. When I started the application process, I began by studying what successful applicants did to get in. I wanted to see if there was a certain profile that Harvard liked to see in its applications. In reality, I was looking for a proven pattern of successful applicants or a winning formula that I could follow.

I figured it out the best I could and eventually got in. It wasn’t until after I went to Harvard Business School and started talking to classmates that I realized I DID do it right. You see, I found that my classmates had used the same principles to create successful applications that I did.

But do you want to know what my real epiphany moment was?

Victor: What?

Ryan: One day I realized WHY Harvard Business School looked for the profile it did. You see, this was not at all clear to me when I was applying. I could kind of figure out what seemed to work… but I was never sure. However, once I figured out WHY Harvard Business School looked for what it did – I knew the process was right.

Victor: How did you know? What was the turning point for you?

Ryan: Harvard Business School has a very distinctive culture. Nothing at Harvard Business School happens by accident. It is frankly a machine. From the way they make housing assignments, to managing landscaping projects on campus to selecting new students – the place is a disciplined, deliberate, well-oiled machine. The Harvard Business School “system” always, always has a plan… and they stick to it. Seriously, nothing happens by accident.

One day in class, it occurred to me that I wasn’t terribly fond of some of my classmates. While most of them were great, some of them kind of just rubbed me the wrong way. In some cases there were big egos, in other cases our styles didn’t mesh, and finally for others I outright just couldn’t stand their personalities.

BUT… and this is my epiphany moment… there was NEVER a time I did not respect them as leaders.

Victor: What do you mean?

Ryan: You see… I knew that just about everyone had tremendous leadership potential. Some of the people that rubbed me the wrong way had the most leadership potential. Whether it was the person who I could see as the future CEO of an international conglomerate, future president of a small nation or a futureUS Senator – these people were all going places. That’s when it all clicked for me.

Haravrd Business School isn’t looking for MBA students…
they’re looking for future Haravrd Business School alumni!

Victor: Interesting. So what’s the implication of this?

Ryan: Well for me, everything suddenly made sense. I knew WHY they liked me. I also realized what mistake I had made. You see, Harvard Business School liked my strengths – and was willing to overlook my weaknesses.

Early on, I made the mistake of focusing on my weaknesses. While I ultimately realized it was important to focus on my strengths, I didn’t realize until after I got in just how important this would be. Now, I know that my weaknesses weren’t likely to keep me out of Harvard Business School – but a lack of a great strength would. Fortunately for me, I did have some great strengths and played them up for all they were worth.

Victor: Ryan lets change gears for a moment. It seems like you’ve learned a lot about the essence of Harvard Business School and how the school’s culture and values are reflected in the application process. I’m wondering why you’ve decided to share this information.

Ryan: There are a couple of reasons. For me, Harvard Business School was a fantastic experience. It was a life changing experience for me, and I’d love it for everyone to have the same experience that I had. I really believe that there are a lot of great people that didn’t get in when they could have. You see Harvard Business School makes two kinds of admissions mistakes.

1) It admits lousy applicants with great applications. These are the people that don’t contribute anything in class and that profs and other students complain about.

2) The other is Harvard Business School rejects great applicants with weak applications.

These are the people that should be at Harvard Business School… and that should be accessible to me as future alumni. These are the people I’m trying to help with my toolkit.

How to Get Into Harvard Business School
9 Strategies for Successful Harvard Business School Applications

Victor: Interesting. Let’s come back to that in a second. First, tell me more about why Harvard Business School became a life changing event. Can you talk a little bit about where you were before Harvard Business School and what’s happened to your life since Harvard Business School?

Ryan: Sure Victor. To start off with, there’s no doubt that Harvard Business School has been a life changing experience for me. It really put me on a different trajectory, especially with my career.

You know, before Harvard Business School I would have said my career track, my professional upside, and my salary were fairly limited, and I wasn’t going to be getting a lot further than where I was at. I felt like I was stuck at my job with a boss that wasn’t interested in my potential or helping me develop as a professional… and I didn’t see any easy way out of the situation.

Frankly, I was staring into a fairly mediocre future. And all that changed after Harvard Business School. Harvard Business School really, really opened up a new world of possibilities for me – from my career prospects, to income, to new contacts and friends. Imagine going from making about $50,000 per year to more than $120,000 per year. The friendships I made and the people I met were even better than all of the career benefits.

Victor: Wow. It sounds like you had a pretty good experience there.

Ryan: Oh, absolutely.

Victor: No wonder you’re so enthusiastic about Harvard Business School – it made a fairly dramatic difference to your life.

Earlier, you mentioned that great applicants often don’t get in because they make mistakes on their application. And of course, great applicants with bad applications don’t get in.

Can you share a few of the common mistakes that you see and that you’ve identified in your toolkit?

Ryan: Sure! In the first module of my toolkit, I talk about one of the most common Harvard Business School application mistakes. When applicants convey the reasons why they want to go to Harvard Business School and why Harvard Business School is going to want them, a lot of applicants give very generic answers to both questions. What they don’t realize is the other 10,000 applicants are using the same answers.

Many applicants never really think about why they want to go to Harvard Business School or how they could benefit the school – especially the latter.

Victor, you have to keep in mind what I said earlier. Harvard Business School is not looking to admit students it is looking to admit future alumni. If you’re an applicant, you have to tell Harvard Business School what they’re going to get from you.

You have to give personal, not generic responses to everything in the Harvard Business School application.

Victor: What exactly do you mean by generic vs. personal?

Ryan: Let me give you an example.

A common reason many applicants site for wanting to go to Harvard Business School is they want to make more money. Well, who doesn’t want to make more money?

So one of the things I talk about in the toolkit is a process one can use to take a fairly generic answer and convert it into a highly specific and personal answer – an answer that only you could possible give.

Again the goal is to convey to Harvard Business School that you are a unique person with a unique set of goals and a special person who can contribute something to the Harvard Business School environment.

Victor: So, if I understand you correctly, a lot of applicants will give the same response to an essay question as other applicants… and you’re saying that that’s a bad thing. Is that right?

Ryan: Absolutely. You can’t be the same as everybody else at Harvard Business School. At Harvard Business School, they only let one or two of each type in, and so your goal is really to be a very unique person, a one of a kind.

Victor: Got it. I know that in your toolkit you describe a methodology for picking the best examples to use in an applicant’s essay. I know you want to save the details for the buyers of your toolkit, but could you show us an example of how an applicant’s profile might change after using this process?

Ryan: Sure. Why don’t I continue with my earlier example. I was working with one applicant who said he wanted to go to Harvard Business School so that he could make more money.

Of course, this answer, while true, is a bad, bad answer to give – at least in its original form. As I started using my methodology with this applicant, I discovered that he really did have a plan as to how he was going to make a lot of money.

Victor: What was his plan?

Ryan: He wanted to be an entrepreneur and to start a company in an unusual sector of the economy – energy. He also had a very clear plan to make that company successful. His plans were specific, tangible and motivated by specific experiences he’s had in his career.

Victor: Hmm…. Interesting.

Ryan: EXACTLY.

You see Harvard Business School doesn’t have that many alumni that fit that profile. It’s a great fit. Again, Harvard Business School is looking for future alumni – not prospective students.

Victor: So is the key to success to say that you plan to do something unusual after you graduate?

Ryan: Victor – I think you’re missing the point. Let me try again.

This particular individual had done certain things in his career that were consistent with his post-graduation plans. So not only was his answer unique but it was also credible.

No other applicant could have submitted the same essay. His response was so tightly intertwined with his own background and experiences… it was impossible to separate the essay answer from the individual.

Victor: So a great essay answer is one that some other applicant couldn’t possible write or at least write credibly?

Ryan: That’s right!

Victor: I can see how that’s a lot more compelling than, “I want to make a lot of money”.

Ryan: In fact, you want to do this with your entire application.

Victor: Wow... this is great. And you talk about this in more detail in your book right?

Ryan: Absolutely… and that’s only in module 1. I also cover 8 other strategies.

Victor: I can see how that one idea alone could really make the difference between just getting in or just getting rejected. What other common mistakes can you share with us today.

Ryan: Victor should I tell you about one of the biggest stumbling blocks most applicants fall for without even knowing about it? It’s also the #1 thing successful applicants do right even if they aren’t consciously aware of it.

Victor: Yes. That sounds intriguing.

Ryan: A successful applicant must not fear being intimate in their application.

Victor: I’m not sure I understand what you mean.

Ryan: To have a successful application, it really helps to “open up” and share something that is very personal to you – it could be an experience, something you did, or something that you would not otherwise share with people.

The point here is to show two things:

1) that you are a real human being with feelings (and not just another “application”) and

2) imply that you aren’t hiding anything in your application.

Victor: So don’t most applicants already know that? Is it really that common of a mistake?

Ryan: It’s a very, very common mistake.

A lot of applicants mistakenly believe that they need to emulate or be the kind of person the admissions board is looking for. They hide particular aspects of their personality and try and portray themselves as something that they’re not.

This is a bad move. Keep in mind the following rule of thumb:

Harvard Business School admits people and reject applications.

Victor: And when you see an application of someone who perhaps is not revealing much about themselves versus one that is, how does it look different? How does it come across to the reader?

Ryan: As you read an application like that, you can really feel that the person hasn’t opened themselves up. The application sounds sterile, uninspired and lacking passion.

You end up feeling like the person is either “nobody special” or is hiding something. And whenever somebody’s hiding something, we all know what they’re hiding, it must be something bad.

And so as an applicant, part of your goal here is to help that reader know that you’ve shared everything with them, that you’re a real person, and that you’ve got something to offer the Harvard Business School community.

Victor: Interesting. Ryan you have characterized this mistake as a fear. Why in your opinion is it a fear? And what exactly are people afraid of?

Ryan: Well, the fear is to really open up to a complete stranger in a one-way, anonymous medium of communication. I think it’s just a natural human response to avoid sharing completely who you are with somebody who you don’t know.

Victor: Okay. I get it. So it’s important to be intimate with the reader of your application –acting as if they’re a confident that you can reveal yourself to.

Ryan: Absolutely!

Victor: It kind of reminds me of one of my blind dates. Is that the feeling you’re talking about… is it safe to reveal too much?

Ryan: Exactly, you can imagine how that is. Your natural instinct is to protect yourself – limit your risk of being rejected on the dating scene. It’s the same instinctive, even unconscious, reaction one goes through when applying to Harvard Business School.

Victor: Exactly. I can see why that would be a problem. I know that would be a little scary for me to share that much about myself. But is that what it really takes to get in?

Ryan: There is absolutely no doubt. You’ve got to be able to open up to the admission board and really share who you are and do that through the application.

Victor: Can you think of an example, maybe in your own application that you wouldn’t mind sharing? If you don’t want to share this for obvious reasons, I certainly understand that. Can you discuss perhaps how you felt about revealing that information?

Ryan: Absolutely. And, I don’t mind sharing some specifics on that. The last time I did that I got into Harvard Business School… so I have no problems doing that.

Victor: Great.

Ryan: I think the biggest thing that I had to grapple was with on my application was being passed over for a promotion.

Victor: That sounds interesting.

Ryan: So here I am facing an application and I can’t tell these people that I was passed over for a promotion can I? Surely, that’s not “Harvard Business School material” right?

Well, as I thought it through carefully, there were a lot of very, very good outcomes from my being passed over for a promotion. And so I decided to actually talk about it.

Victor: Yeah, I know which of your essays you’re talking about. I read your essay as a part of the Harvard Business School Success Stories compilation that you’re working on.

To be honest, I was a little surprised that you were so upfront about something that I would have guessed would be perceived as very negative.

Can you elaborate on why you did that and what you think you got out of that?

Ryan: Sure. I thought it was a perfect opportunity to communicate some very important characteristics about myself. I communicated I don’t quit, I don’t give up.

When I was denied the promotion, I took the opportunity to solicit more mentoring from the senior leaders in my firm. By the end of the year, I ended up with a top ranking in my peer group.

Those were some key things that I took out of the experience… and I shared those. So when the admission board gets done reading my application and they say wow I think I really know this person.

He has just shared a significant disappointment in his life and I know how he responded to it. I see how he used it for something positive. This is the type of person I want to be in my classroom and as part of our alumni community.

Victor: Interesting. So you actually used the failure as a way of revealing other attributes about yourself. It was a vehicle more than anything else it sounds like.

Ryan: Yeah, I took it and used it as a vehicle to demonstrate some of my strengths… while being very honest and revealing about my weaknesses.

Victor: So far you’ve been advising applicants to give personal, not generic responses within the application it also sounds like you’re advising applicants to not be afraid to reveal themselves?

Ryan: Right.

Victor: Even though it may be an emotionally difficult thing to do?

Ryan: Yes. Think about it.

Can you see how an applicant that to his/her friends appears somewhat average could in fact write a phenomenal application?

One that gives very personal reasons for why they want to go to Harvard Business School and why Harvard Business School should want them?

Answers that nobody else could possibly give.

And reveal some of their deepest and most intimate thoughts about their life achievements and failures… their insecurities, hopes and dreams.

Can you see how such an application can really stand out?

Victor: Wow… just listening to you, I get a kind of visceral reaction. I would be very engaged and intrigued by such an application. It would feel more like a gripping auto-biography that a business school application.

Ryan: That’s exactly right. Remember: Harvard Business School admits people, but rejects applications. You absolutely must get Harvard Business School to see you as a person.

Victor: I think I’m starting to really understand Harvard Business School and what makes the institution tick.

Ryan: I’m glad. Harvard Business School is very, very predictable. You just need an insider to point these things out… and more importantly how to ethically exploit this knowledge in the application process.

Victor: Okay Ryan, let me risk crossing over the line of appropriateness. Would it be too much to ask you to share just one more strategy that you and your classmates used to get into Harvard Business School?

Ryan: No problem. Let’s see. Well I think one of the biggest ones that I’m going to mention may be obvious to some people, but not as obvious to others. One of the big points I make in my toolkit is the importance of honesty and integrity in the Harvard Business School application – especially this year.

Let me talk about why this is important and more importantly what it reveals about how Harvard Business School does things and the implications it has for future applicants.

Victor: That sounds good.

Ryan: For whatever reason, I know there are a large percentage of Harvard Business School applicants who feel tremendous pressure to get into Harvard Business School. Whether they feel limited in their current career opportunities, have an overwhelming desire to work outside the US, age, family pressure, whatever it may be… It’s really becoming increasingly more important to be absolutely honest on the application.

The current business environment has reflected poor ethical choices by business leaders and it’s become one of the primary topics in business schools… even more so at Harvard Business School to ensure that applicants are entirely honest.

Victor: Have you seen anything that has anything changed in the past few years that gives you a greater sense of conviction on this particular point?

Ryan: Absolutely. During my first year, we had the pleasure of having a lot of high profile visitors come to campus. One of them was the CEO of Enron and another one was the CFO of Tyco.

Victor: Interesting. Of course, these companies are now known for their accounting, ethical and legal scandals.

Ryan: These two specific individuals were in fact Harvard Business School graduates.

Victor: Ouch!

Ryan: Exactly! They came to campus and actually visited my section.

Frankly, Harvard Business School is embarrassed about the behavior of some of these graduates. They are doing everything they can to ensure that there is not another graduate that is ever involved in this type of behavior.

Victor: So do you think this embarrassment factor is one driver of why there is a big push on honesty and integrity in the Harvard Business School application process?

Ryan: Absolutely. Like I said earlier, nothing at Harvard Business School happens by accident. They knew they had a problem with at best being associated with unethical leaders and at worst being associated with criminals… and they are pretty determined to fix it.

They may not be able to control their graduates, but they can certainly sever any ties with any unscrupulous applicants.

Think about it.

If someone is willing to lie about their resume or background just to get into business school, what’s to prevent them from fabricating $1 billion in revenue and pocket $50M in the process?

Like I said, Harvard Business School doesn’t admit students. It admits future alumni.

Victor: Have there been other classroom experiences that have given you more insight into the application process itself?

I know we were talking earlier about how you observed certain things in the classroom which helped you better understand what Harvard Business School was looking for and why.

Ryan: Sure. I think once you’re in the classroom, you quickly identify people who are clearly the cream of the crop. And at the same time, you recognize those that clearly do not belong at Harvard Business School. These people are frankly a problem for the professors and administration because they disrupted the classroom environment.

Victor: It sounds like you’re talking about the “other” kind of admissions mistake that you referred to earlier.

Ryan: Yes. These “admit mistakes” lacked a sense of responsibility to the classroom. Since Harvard Business School students really teach themselves while the profs facilitate, it comes through pretty quickly if someone isn’t holding up their end of the bargain… and that’s something that cannot be tolerated in the Harvard Business School classroom format.

Victor: And what does that mean exactly when you say a lack of responsibility for the class overall?

Ryan: Well each individual student carries with them the responsibility to prepare everyday for the case. When a student comes into Harvard Business School lacking that sense of responsibility it hurts the classroom because you don’t learn from them.

Victor: And as you reflect on the application process, is there something the Harvard Business School admissions board is looking for in the application itself to help weed out people like this?

Ryan: This definitely comes through in the application. As a matter of fact, the recommendation form was recently changed and now asks a specific question related to the applicant’s ability to perform in the Harvard Business School classroom format.

In addition, an applicant may unintentionally communicate in their application that they don’t really understand and appreciate the Harvard Business School classroom learning format. This is a very big mistake.

It is very critical for an applicant to convey that they implicitly understand what it means to be an Harvard Business School student… it actually means you’re going to be a teacher! See, you have to convey that you’re able, willing and excited to play that role.

Victor: So, how does an applicant convey this understanding of the classroom?

Ryan: I suggest taking a subtle approach. What you do is you demonstrate the level understanding that you have of the classroom environment by the way that you talk about yourself and your candidacy.

It’s more of an implicit communication than an explicit one. You simply drop a comment here or there showing how you’re going to teach your peers.

Victor: And when you do that, what comes across to the admission committee when one does that?

Ryan: What comes across to the admission board is you’re a person who really understands the school. When you research the school, you know the school and you demonstrate you are very interested in the school. You also demonstrate that this particular learning environment can help you grow.

The Harvard Business School learning environment does not suit everybody. And so, part of the admissions board’s job is to weed out candidates who are very qualified to be at Harvard Business School but where the learning environment at Harvard Business School doesn’t suit the candidate.

Victor: Intriguing. So even if Harvard Business School sees a great applicant… if the applicant isn’t compatible with the school format, they would actually turn them down? Is that what you’re saying?

Ryan: Definitely. In my toolkit, I identify a number of reasons why an otherwise qualified applicant could be rejected from Harvard Business School. Not being compatible with the school format is one of them.

Once in a while you find a great student that gets into virtually every other business school, buts get rejected from Harvard Business School… and you wonder why?

One reason is that Harvard Business School doesn’t want students… they want student-teachers.

The great tragedy comes from those candidates that were in fact good student-teachers, but did not convey that in their application and were later rejected.

Victor: I can see how that would be very disappointing to an applicant. On the flip side, have you seen people in the classroom who perhaps should have turned down?

Ryan: Definitely.

As I mentioned earlier, there are certainly people where you think to yourself, you know what, surely there were applicants that may have been better qualified than this person.

So you have to ask, why didn’t that other applicant get in? And it comes down to the strategies that I share in my toolkit.

Many of the applicants that get rejected made a fundamental mistake in their application. Oftentimes this is because they were simply unaware of one of the key strategies for a successful Harvard Business School application.

I think the biggest loss of all is when Harvard Business School declines a great applicant who didn’t happen to create a great application. The applicant loses out. Harvard Business School loses out from having a great admit... and people like me lose out on not having a great resource in the Harvard Business School alumni network.

I wrote my toolkit for those people… the good candidates who want to make sure they have great applications.

Victor: Well what if an applicant has a few weaknesses? Does that make them a weaker applicant?

Ryan: A good applicant is someone who lacks weakness.

A great applicant is someone who has something great going for them.

Victor: Ryan – This is a very interesting point. As you know, I’ve had the opportunity to read your application… It just dawned on me that you were extremely worried about not being a good applicant… Yet, when I read your application, I realized you were in fact a great applicant.

You had a few very compelling things going for you… and I must admit, while I was reading your application I was so engaged and so convinced that you were going somewhere that the weakness didn’t seem that important to me.

I can see why Harvard Business School admitted you… and then felt strong enough about your candidacy that they didn’t even bother interviewing you. Yet, I can also see why you were worried early on.

Paradoxically, you met the definition of a “great” applicant, but not the definition of a “good” applicant.

Ryan: Exactly!

That’s exactly what I finally figured out about the Harvard Business School culture and school mentality. There are a lot of extreme people at Harvard Business School… yet they by and large all demonstrate strong leadership potential.

To get into Harvard Business School, you have to be a “great” applicant… and it is very possible to be a “great” applicant without being a “good” one. I’m living proof of that. That being said, if you have the background and career assets to be both “good” and “great”… that’s even better.

Like I said, nothing happens by accident at Harvard Business School. To get into the school, it really helps to understand what makes it tick, what motivates it, and how they think. It makes it a lot easier to present yourself in the absolutely best light possible.

Victor: So is the “perfect” candidate a myth?

Ryan: I don’t think there is anybody who is a perfect admit.

The lack of a weakness does not get you into Harvard Business School… the presence of a strength does.

My Harvard Business School classmates used one or more of the strategies that I discuss in my toolkit to get in. They all have their strengths and trust me when I say none of them are flawless.

Victor: So people shouldn’t panic if they have some weaknesses in their application then?

Ryan: Absolutely not. Instead, they should be focusing on how to best accentuate their strengths.

Incidentally, this is also why compromising your integrity to cover up a weakness is so foolish – in most cases it doesn’t even impact the admission decision.

I know Harvard Business School classmates of mine that openly acknowledged in their application that they were unemployed for close to a year or who openly admitted to “hanging out” with illegal drug users while growing up.

Victor: Wow… You’d think that would keep someone out.

Ryan: To make sense of this, you just have to understand how Harvard Business School works.

Harvard Business School claims its mission is to educate the world’s leaders. I actually disagree with this. The school’s behavior demonstrates its real mission is to call the world’s greatest business leaders their alumni.

These very powerful and wealthy alumni can then hire more recent Harvard Business School graduates and donate a lot of money back to the school.

Victor: I guess you weren’t kidding when you said Harvard Business School does do everything for a reason.

Ryan: Tell me about it! They even hit me up for a donation as they handed me my diploma! I’m completely serious… everything, and I mean everything happens at Harvard Business School for a reason.

And one of the things Harvard Business School really wants to do is get tomorrow’s leaders into Harvard Business School today. So, if you can demonstrate that you have raw leadership talent, even if you have a problem or two in your application, you’ve got an excellent chance in being admitted to Harvard Business School.